The Fresh Loaf

A Community of Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts.

Most bookmarked

July 20, 2009 - 8:02am
clazar123's picture
clazar123

Pillowsoft crumb-technique?

I guess pillow soft is a good description of what I want to achieve. When you squeeze-test a package of these buns, they feel like a pillow you would sleep on.Depresses easily but has bounceback. I'm not talking "store-bought" guar gum,air injected buns,stick-like-wallpaper paste-to-the-roof-of-your-mouth kind of buns. I have seen soft sandwich buns at a local organic, flour,water,yeast,salt,starter kind of bakery.It is easy to get a bite without all the filling squishing out.  Of course, they don't want to talk about technique-then I wouldn't buy their buns. My bread crumb turns out chewier-it's good but I want to be able to achieve the soft bun.

I have sifted this site numberous times and I'm missing something because I'm not able to achieve this. I have tried adding:potatoes, milk,eggs and oil after various posters suggested that. Delicious experiments but still not there. I have to believe it is a technique or hydration issue rather than an ingredient issue. I have always used either Better for Bread (Gold MedalBrand) flour or AP flour for these endeavors. I also use a KitchenAid stand mixer and favor using sourdough with a little additional yeast due to time constraints (I bake on weekends).

So, how does one achieve a pillowy crumb and a crust that is thin and easy to bite off without being tough?

 

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 20, 2009 - 5:22am
avatrx1's picture
avatrx1

interesting info on food storage including grains, flours etc

In my search for spelt flour, my brother directed me to a company that sells all types of grains, beans, flours, etc for long term storage.

the name of the place is Walton Feeds.  They are based in Idaho.  You can download their catalog to see what they offer and how much the stuff is.  Eveything from dried beans, to 50lb bags of flour to grain mills (no photos of the grain mills that I could find) , but what I found very interesting was the information on this particular area of their site that talks about long term storage and expected results.

http://waltonfeed.com/blog/show/article_id/162

Since so many folks on THIS site are probably "from scratch" bakers etc, I thought you might be interested in the information provided.

One thing I didn't know, that I discovered reading thru this site, is that those little packets you find in so many things (the little 1-1/2" square packets in clear wrap?) are used to remove oxygen from the items which they're packed in.  I knew they said something about a freshness packet, but I didn't know they were designed to suck out oxygen................

anyway - if you get a chance - check out the link.  you may find it as intersting as I did.

-Susie

 

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 19, 2009 - 3:41am
Shiao-Ping's picture
Shiao-Ping

Sourdough Black Tea Bread - using James MacGuire's Pain de Tradition procedure

      

       Sourdough Black Tea Bread - using James MacGuire's Pain de Tradition procedure

                                   

                                   the crumb

I always remember that very dense Black Tea Sourdough that I made a month ago (it feels like ages ago).  Back then I received a lot of kind remarks and encouragements but really the sourdough was like a stone.  So, I had on my list to try my hands again at some stage.   With the new technique I learned from making James MacGuire's Pain de Tradition, I thought my time was ripe for a second go at it.  Back then, my dough hydration was a shy 64% with a dough size of 685 g.  This time I jacked up the hydration to 80% (total flour 500 g and total liquid 400 g) for a dough size of 910g.   Not only that, I gave the dough an overnight cold retardation in the fridge.

My formula 

210 g wholemeal starter @ 75% hydration

290 g white bread flour

90 g KAF Sir Lancelot high gluten flour

125 g cool black tea (I used 2 English Breakfast tea bags)

151 g water

18 g honey

16 g Tea Liqueur

10 g salt  

2 g instant dry yeast

 

With only mother and son at home (my husband and daughter are away on the International Young Physicist Tournament in China) I was afraid that I would have a lot left over; but no, my son couldn't have enough of it, and he made me slice up the whole loaf. 

                   

                    more crumb

                                                                                            

                                                                                            and the close-up

Tonight my muse is the music from my late teens/early 20s; my whole house is ringing with the music, I think my roof is protesting.  My son walks out of his bedroom, dancing to the music.  He has a smile on his face as, when the daddy is away, the mummy lets him free-range. 

Oh, let me get back to the bread.

The bread is lovely.  It's too easy - with MacGuire's procedure.  The crumb is favourful and the mouthfeel is mildly chewy - totally unlike the cottony/fairy floss like crumb of yeasted breads.  There is "substance" to the crumb.  The addition of sourdough starter and the retardation overnight really do the trick for me. 

One complaint - I might have over-dosed the bread with the instant dry yeast!  Even though I used the prescribed quantity (ie, 2 g), I think less instant yeast so that the dough doesn't rise up too much might be good. 

Isn't that funny - a month ago I couldn't have enough aeration and holes in my sourdough, now I am begging for less!

Shiao-Ping 

 

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 18, 2009 - 6:20pm
Nomadcruiser53's picture
Nomadcruiser53

No bread, but a tasty pie

Well, I watched Bobby Flay take on The Elegant Farmer in Mukwanago, WI. in an apple pie throwdown. The Elegant Farmer did his with a sugar cookie crust done in a brown paper bag. I just had to try it. Eating it all ourselves would have been selfish so we had another couple over for dessert on the deck. I'm not artistic and don't try. Here's the pie. It was great.

The pie steams in the bag at 375 for and hour. Then cut a circle out of the top of the bag and brown for another 15 mins. I was very happy with the outcome. Dave

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 18, 2009 - 12:12pm
venkitac's picture
venkitac

Dumb question: how to delete photos from my freshloaf account

 

I'm out of quota space for photos, I've been fiddling with the file upload page and popup for a while now to figure out how to delete photos, no luck. I will freely admit that I feel like an idiot, I even searched the site for help and couldn't find out. Help!

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 18, 2009 - 11:16am
flournwater's picture
flournwater

Fantastic Cornbread

I have never liked sweet cornbread.  I can't remember ever, until now, having eaten a sweet cornbread that tasted good enough for me to want another piece.  This morning I finished the BBA Challenge assignment for Peter Reinhart's cornbread as published in "The Bread Bakers Apprentice".  It's incredible, in spite of the fact that it calls for granulated sugar, brown sugar and honey.

The full recipe was far too large for our needs so I reduced it by half.  That was fairly easy, until I came to dividing 3 eggs, but using one whole egg and one egg yolk solved that problem.  Baked in an 8 inch (rim to rim measurement) cast iron pan.



Click on thumbnails for larger view

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 18, 2009 - 8:52am
MommaT's picture
MommaT

recipe or name for greek daily bread with sesame on top

Hi,

 

I had the very big pleasure of spending the last two weeks in a tiny village on the coast of greece, south and east of Kalamata.

The primary bread at the local grocery store, and every taberna we visited, was the same simple loaf. Oval or torpedo shaped, it had a moderate to fine crumb with white-bread taste (although quite yellow inside) and sesame seeds all over the top.  It did not taste overly milky or egg-y, but more like a loaf with quite basic ingredients.

My kids (and I) really enjoyed this bread.  Does anyone know the name of the bread or have a recipe?

Thanks!

MommaT

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 17, 2009 - 9:13pm
dmsnyder's picture
dmsnyder

Pain de Tradition Sourdough

 

When Shiao-Ping showed us the “Pain de Tradition” of James McGuire, I knew I was going to make it. The bread she made was gorgeous and good to eat. The techniques used were very congenial to me, since I have really had good results from “stretch and fold in the bowl” mixing with other breads. Besides, the one bread attributed to McGuire I've made (repeatedly) – the “Miche, Pointe-à-Callière” in Hamelman's “Bread” - is a wonderful bread.

I immediately thought of making this bread as a sourdough. Shiao-Ping and then Eric beat me to the draw. Here is mine.

I followed Shiao-Ping's formula. My starter has some rye and some whole wheat flour, but I used KAF Bread Flour exclusively to make the dough. I did add 2 gms of Instant Yeast, although my feeling was, like Eric's, that less would be better, particularly since my kitchen temperature was around 80F.

As I did the repeated stretch and folds, I felt the dough was not developing as well as I was accustomed to using this technique. So, for the last two sets of stretch and folds, I folded 15-20 times, rather than 8-10 times. At the end, the dough was still very loose. My inclination would have been to do a tight pre-shaping, but I stuck with the directions and just transferred the dough to a floured board to rest for 15 minutes under the bowl. I shaped a boule by gathering the edges of the dough to the center and sealing the seams. I then transferred the loaf to a well-floured, linen-lined banneton to proof.

I proofed for about 40 minutes, at which time the loaf had expanded no more than 50%. I transferred it to parchment on a peel and loaded onto my pre-heated baking stone. The rest of the baking procedure was as Shiao-Ping described.

 

This is the lightest-colored loaf I've baked in years. I might like this bread baked darker (by baking at a higher temperature), but the light-colored crust sure shows up the yellow pigments in the flour. Others have remarked on how yellow or “cream”-colored the crumb is on this bread. Well, my crust was too!

I baked the loaf to 210F internal temperature, then baked it 5 minutes more, then left it in the oven for 10 minutes more with the oven off and the door ajar. The crust still softened as the bread cooled.

The crumb is classic sourdough - randomly scattered holes of varying size. The mouth feel is cool and tender yet chewy. When first tasted, completely cooled, it has a lovely aroma and flavor. It is actually more assertively sour than expected.

This is a lovely bread. I'll make it again. I'd like to try it with a darker crust and a thicker one. 

David

 

 

 

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 17, 2009 - 3:37pm
ehanner's picture
ehanner

SF SD With many folds

Today I made a second batch of the Multi fold, no knead bread Shiao-Ping as been working on and posting. I decided to make a few changes in concept to suit my style.I started with her SFSD post HERE and except for the yeast and flours and baking temp, followed that method.

First, instead of using yeast to rise the dough and sourdough starter to flavor it, I used a scant 1/4 teaspoon of yeast and relied on my robust starter to provide leavening. So it was a true sourdough loaf. Next time I'll skip the yeast totally.

Second, I added 5% rye flour to the dough mix. In the past I have found that even a small amount of rye helps the depth of flavor greatly. In this case I added 25g of whole rye.

Third, I found I needed an extra 30 minutes ferment time for the dough to feel right, so call it 4.75 hours ferment time total at 73 degrees F. That was also the dough temperature.

Forth, I gave the proof time 40 minutes. I'm not certain that I didn't over do that by a few minutes. The crust expanded well but the cuts got all weird like a cat fight happened on top. As usual scoring is my Achilles heel and the first thing to go.

Lastly, I wasn't happy with the chewiness of the crust yesterday baking for an hour  at 350F. Today I used 450F for 10 minutes, steamed and lowered the temp to 430 for another 20 minutes. The crust would have been more crisp had I left it in the oven for 5-10 minutes to dry. I may get a tattoo reminding me to stay on checklist. I like the crust much better today.

Overall, the flavor of the sourdough is mild and the overall taste is great. It is remarkable how creamy yellow the crumb is and how well the dough feels using only a plastic scraper to fold a few times. I think it is a safe statement that our mixers are oxygenating the dough and do nothing for flavor. Simple hand mixing and gently folding will develop gluten and deliver to your hands a very luxurious and satiny dough. I didn't pull a window pane but I assure you that this dough is the essence of gluten development.

I like the schedule of this bread. I started it at 8 AM and I'm eating it at 4 PM. My other Sourdough breads I usually start in the evening after dinner and get them in the oven around 10 AM. -12 PM. That's OK but I like the one day aspect. When I have time, I know I can make a good loaf on the day I think of it.

That's it. One day SF SD. Not the best bread I've ever made but pretty darn good for a one day project. No Mixer needed!

Eric

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo
July 17, 2009 - 1:04pm
bassopotamus's picture
bassopotamus

Bread seems less sour

I've got a 67% hydradation starter that has been going about 7 months now, and lately, it seems less sour than it used to. Some background:

 

Mother lives in the fridge full time and gets fed once or twice a week as needed.

She gets 3 parts flour to 2 parts filtered water to 1 part starter at feeding time.

I feed half all trumps high gluten and half king arthur whole wheat.

I bake about 16 loaves a week.

 

About 3 weeks back, I dropped the mother I was using and cracked shattered the plastic container. For the sake of safety, I through out my big container. I keep 4 oz of emergency back up, which was about 1 month old at the time. I built up the mother from that (I keep about 24 oz on hand). The leavening power is still there, the starter smells like it did. I'm doing a two stage build (same recipie as always). 4 oz mother gets built to 30 oz of in between starter, then the next day the 30 oz gets is used to make about 2.8 kg of dough. At both stages, the rise is really good for a wild yeast starter. Final bread has a nice texture, nice crust, but isnt' real sour.

 

So what should I do to get some of the sour flavor back? My recipe doesn't use a ton of mother, but it is the same one I always used. Do I need to change my feeding schedule for a while? Change what I'm feeding for a while (started with rye, could feed a few times with rye) . Other suggestions are welcome.

 

 

 

 

Share
  • Facebook logo
  • Twitter logo

Pages

more